Sequels and Fan-Made games

Water · **Posted:** Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:06 pm

Plasma wrote:

Water, it's because you can't user-test an unfinished game, and you can't make major changes to a finished one. Thus, if there's a gameplay system that doesn't really work out well in the final result, there's not too much you can do without ripping parts of the game to change it.

Unless you mean bugs. But that's an entirely different matter.

Hmm... That is a good point... And it's a pretty big problem. I wonder if video gaming will ever move beyond it.

Bill Nye the Science Guy · **Posted:** Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:09 pm

Mond wrote:

What a shame.

its back on now
no excuse

DoNotDelete · **Posted:** Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:14 pm

Hahaha!

I'm half asleep and thought this thread was titled 'Squirrels and Fan-Made Games'.

Mond · **Posted:** Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:16 pm

Bill Nye the Science Guy wrote:

no excuse

God yes I remember that episode. Love that song. It always reminds me of how great that game's soundtrack was.
I think Yahtzee also referenced Deus Ex in 7 Days a Skeptic at some point. Some character's password was knight_killer, the same as Manderley's in Deus Ex.
Since we're already talking about Deus Ex.

Airigh · **Posted:** Sat Oct 03, 2009 4:24 pm

DoNotDelete wrote:

Hahaha!

I'm half asleep and thought this thread was titled 'Squirrels and Fan-Made Games'.

I do that all the time.

Plasma · **Posted:** Sat Oct 03, 2009 5:57 pm

Ryushusupercat wrote:

These crappy new Sonic games make me sad...

I wouldn't exactly call an 11 year old game to be 'new'.

Ame no Akai wrote:

I strongly dislike Street Fighter IV. Call me nostalgic, but that 3D style they have going now just doesn't cut it for me.

The only thing I didn't like about SF4's style is the backgrounds. More specifically, they're too colourful and jumpy. Normally in Street Fighter games, the backgrounds are usually made very distinguished from the foreground, by means of being bland. 'Tis rather distracting, really.

Water wrote:

I wonder if video gaming will ever move beyond it.

Move bey- what? Sorry, but it can't exactly be changed, it's something that... just is. It's like saying "I wonder if play scripts will ever move on from using written text".

Indigo_Dingo · **Posted:** Sat Oct 03, 2009 9:29 pm

Water wrote:

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

Water wrote:

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

Bacon wrote:

Different technologies get developed, etc.

There's also feedback.

Alright guys, three to five word responses are not going to work here. I honestly have no idea what either of you is trying to say.

A developer can work on problems pointed out to them by fans and reviewers. For example in Uncharted 2, among other things, they've buffed up the length, added multiplayer and co-op, allowed a lot more terrain interaction, and made the enemies Italians. Hence why its getting perfect scores.

Okay, but when the developers were making Uncharted 1, why didn't they catch those problems while making it? Is it a deadline schedule in the video game business that causes developers to release games they know have flaws? Is it that the flaws in the game are discovered too late in development to be changed without completely erasing and starting over on a chunk of the game engine? Or is it that developers are too busy looking at the minute details that they don't catch the larger problems that occur when those details come together, problems that many players and reviewers spot immediately?

It may be any combination of these, I suppose.

Wait, who said they know they have flaws? A flaw doesn't have to be a glitch in the system, it can be gameplay not working to precisely how the players want, it can be a longer story or a certain aspect added to writing. The market must tell you what they want, and when they do you can deliver.

The problem is that game making isn't a science, its an art.

And I actually find it funny that Plasma thinks Street Fighter IV is a game thats so good its bad.

Plasma · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 7:05 am

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

And I actually find it funny that Plasma thinks Street Fighter IV is a game thats so good its bad.

Wait, when the hell did I say that? I... I'm serious, how did you manage to take that out of "I didn't like the way they did the backgrounds"?

Water · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 1:44 pm

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

Water wrote:

Okay, but when the developers were making Uncharted 1, why didn't they catch those problems while making it? Is it a deadline schedule in the video game business that causes developers to release games they know have flaws? Is it that the flaws in the game are discovered too late in development to be changed without completely erasing and starting over on a chunk of the game engine? Or is it that developers are too busy looking at the minute details that they don't catch the larger problems that occur when those details come together, problems that many players and reviewers spot immediately?

It may be any combination of these, I suppose.

Wait, who said they know they have flaws? A flaw doesn't have to be a glitch in the system, it can be gameplay not working to precisely how the players want, it can be a longer story or a certain aspect added to writing. The market must tell you what they want, and when they do you can deliver.

The problem is that game making isn't a science, its an art.

I didn't say that was the only circumstance.

Water wrote:

Or is it that developers are too busy looking at the minute details that they don't catch the larger problems that occur when those details come together, problems that many players and reviewers spot immediately?

See? Sometimes developers don't catch the problems that a lot of gamers agree are flaws that keep the game from being as good as it could be. It seems like the only way they could not catch these flaws is if they can't see the forest for the trees. Either that, or they just don't know anything about video games, and honestly think it's a good idea.

I think it's much more likely that developers find these flaws in their games, but can't do anything about that. Seriously, there ought to be some way to remedy that.

Indigo_Dingo · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 3:53 pm

Plasma wrote:

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

And I actually find it funny that Plasma thinks Street Fighter IV is a game thats so good its bad.

Wait, when the hell did I say that? I... I'm serious, how did you manage to take that out of "I didn't like the way they did the backgrounds"?

The background animations moving too much and being too colourful means they've had too much time spent on them. They're too good.

Mond · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 3:58 pm

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

The background animations moving too much and being too colourful means they've had too much time spent on them. They're too good.

Something doesn't get better simply because you spend more time on it.
Sometimes less is more.

Plasma · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 5:25 pm

Water wrote:

Seriously, there ought to be some way to remedy that.

...

Once again, engineering does not work that way! Look, sometimes people screw up and can't do anything sensible about it. Just leave it at that!

Indigo_Dingo · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:08 pm

Mond wrote:

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

The background animations moving too much and being too colourful means they've had too much time spent on them. They're too good.

Something doesn't get better simply because you spend more time on it.
Sometimes less is more.

Hence so good its bad.

Superior Bacon · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:10 pm

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

Mond wrote:

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

The background animations moving too much and being too colourful means they've had too much time spent on them. They're too good.

Something doesn't get better simply because you spend more time on it.
Sometimes less is more.

Hence so good its bad.

That's not how it works.

Indigo_Dingo · **Posted:** Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:22 pm

Ame no Akai wrote:

Bacon wrote:

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

Mond wrote:

Indigo_Dingo wrote:

The background animations moving too much and being too colourful means they've had too much time spent on them. They're too good.

Something doesn't get better simply because you spend more time on it.
Sometimes less is more.

Hence so good its bad.

That's not how it works.

Technically, they could have invested a massive amount of time in it. The details could be incredibly worked out, and that might just be what makes it bad.

It's a weird way to think about things, really, but it sort of applies.

Its also the only way it really would apply. So bad its good comes from when acting, effects and production values are so pathetic that it becomes more fun to laugh at them. Here, we have production values so high it detracts from the experience.

AWKWARD ZOMBIE

Sequels and Fan-Made games

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